Friday, June 22, 2012

Pr. Nathan says it well about UOJ

HT: @Ichabod here.(Updated)

UOJ enthusiasts err when they confuse Christ's all encompassing sacrifice for sin with blanket absolution which they (then) capriciously translate into universal forgiveness and justification for all, thus eliminating the Holy Spirit’s work and activity of creating individual personal faith in the individual (soul) which then justifies.


-- Nathan M. Bickel - emeritus pastor
www.thechristianmessage.org

www.moralmatters.org



Pr. Nathan says it well and gets UOJ right in a nutshell.

6 comments:

LutherRocks said...

Lito, you deftly left off the preceding comment in Bickel's quote: "I still like my cookie jar illustration. Just because there is a cookie jar does not translate into cookies being, within that jar."

To say that there is not a cookie in the jar for every man denies what the atoning sacrifice of Christ has done for the whole world; as if some men were left out of God's plan of salvation. That statement also denies the validity of the parable preached by Christ in Matthew 22. The feast was prepared for all men and there is, was and will be a chair at the table for every man. But not every man receives his cookie or sits at the table. As long as you guys make statements that limit the forgiveness of sins only for believers, they will be filed under 'Calvinist'.

From the Formula under Election:

"15] 1. That the human race is truly redeemed and reconciled with God through Christ, who, by His faultless [innocency] obedience, suffering, and death, has merited for us the righteousness which avails before God, and eternal life."

Christ has merited the righteousness which avails before God for ALL regardless of faith.

LPC said...

Joe,

As long as you guys make statements that limit the forgiveness of sins only for believers, they will be filed under 'Calvinist'.

As long as you make statements that imply the automatic forgiveness of sins of all people without regard to faith, you will be filed under Huberite and quasi-universalist. Huber did the same, called the BoC editors and signers Calvinists.

Here is where you clearly are opposed to The Lord Jesus himself who said...

Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

It is Jesus who says only those who believe will be saved hence forgiven. In your case even those who do not believe are already forgiven and thus saved since faith had nothing to do with it (so you think),

You oppose Christ.

The point of Pr. Nathan is that simply because there is a cookie jar does not imply that there is a cookie inside neither does that imply all people have a cookie.

Your mistake is that though Christ merited righteousness for all men, you think thereby, that automatically implies that this righteousness has already been transfered to all men without regard to faith.

Despite your name calling and barking Joe, the train has already left the station.

LPC

Pastor emeritus Nathan Bickel said...

LPC,

First of all, thank you for highlighting some of my online thoughts about errant universal objective justification enthusiast thinking. If what I say via cyberspace helps, in any small way to clarify this false teaching as opposed to that of Scriptural truth, [then] I am simply gratified.

Secondly, after reading "LutherRocks" comment, I suppose next time I utilize my favorite "cookie jar" illustration, I had better spell it out more clearly. Perhaps, I should state that the cookie jar represents a human soul. But, just because that human soul is being told Sunday after Sunday that his sins are always forgiven (no matter what), that, blanket absolution message does not translate into faith implanted into that individual soul, which justifies that sinful soul before a holy God who is [only] pleased with faith. [Hebrews 11:6]

And, then, I had better somehow explain that no matter how enthusiastic an individual is to eagerly hear the blanket absolution pronounced in form of unconditional forgiveness, that soul is still empty (unfilled) without saving Holy Spirit faith. 2 Thess. 3:2 - tells us about empty soul "cookie jars" - "......for all men have not faith."

Nathan M. Bickel

www.thechristianmessage.org

www.moralmatters.org

LPC said...

But, just because that human soul is being told Sunday after Sunday that his sins are always forgiven (no matter what), that, blanket absolution message does not translate into faith implanted into that individual soul, which justifies that sinful soul before a holy God who is [only] pleased with faith. [Hebrews 11:6]

That is what the UOJ preacher is saying. However, the Law condemns and says you are guilty and deserve to die as penalty for your sins. The Gospel says Jesus paid for your sins, The Law demands death, the Gospel says yes, death has been paid for.

This is totally different from the UOJ Gospel, for them the Gospel skips the payment aspect and jumps over to forgiveness, skipping past what actually the Law demands - payment. In short, for them the Gospel is - God has already forgiven you.

It is not Jesus died for you, rather it is God has already forgiven you.

So in UOJ, faith is not trust but mere assent to historical fact which they alleged to have already occurred, the blanket forgiveness of all sins without regard to faith. It is then the faith of the devil.

Just like Calvinism, they collapse the atonement for sins and justification or forgiveness of sins as one single event. Anyway, no point belabouring this with Joe, he won't like to get it anyway.

LPC

LPC said...

Ohh, I should add the Chemnitz quote here is so most appropriate and a great rebuttal of UOJ...

"The Almighty God has been merciful to you, and through the merit of the most holy suffering death and resurrection of Jesus Christ His beloved Son, He forgives you all your sins, and I as a called and ordained servant of the Christian Church proclaim to all you who truly repent and who through faith place your trust and minds on the merit of Jesus Christ and who order your lives according to the commands and will of God the forgiveness of all of your sins in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Amen. On the contrary however, I say to any impenitent and unbelieving, according to God's Word and in His name, that God has held your sin against you and this certainly is punished. Amen. "

Pastor emeritus Nathan Bickel said...

LPC -

Thank you for for your excellent adept expose of my comment response. Your clear and concise observation of this UOJ perversion is spot on! You certainly zero in and see it clearly for what it is!

Nathan M. Bickel

www.thechristianmessage.org
www.moralmatters.org