Wednesday, June 02, 2010

Intrepid Lutherans

Over here it is not unusual to have granny flats. It is a type of bungalow where a member of the family can stay with you but not with you. Well they are sort of staying with you in that they are in the same compound but not in the same roof.

What has this to do with granny flats? Well Christians and in particular most Lutherans, treat doctrine like a grandma living in a granny flat. She is there but nobody dares to bring her into conversation. She is ignored but everyone knows she is still alive. She is just avoided. No one talks to her, no one talks about her.

I am glad that some WELS folk have decided to blog about what everyone in WELS knows but no one bothered to talk about. I congratulate the people at Intrepid Lutherans for being so bold to face up and debate issues that matter to them the most.

In a way, I see this as analogous to recognizing that grandma is out there in the granny flat, now what are we going to do about her?

Good on Intrepid Lutherans, I admire their courage. I hope they produce a lot of meaty discussions. I made it a point to read the blog daily.


Brett Meyer said...

LPC, I thought Pastor Rydicks 5 point BOC confession on Justification was very good and non-(W)ELS UOJ. Very happily surprised. This point left no room for UOJ's 'all men are declared righteous by God and are under Grace':

We confess “that sins are forgiven for the sake of Christ as our Atoning Sacrifice, ‘whom God put forward as a propitiation’ (Romans 3:25). Furthermore, Paul adds, ‘by faith.’ Therefore, this atonement benefits us in this way: We receive the mercy promised in Him by faith and set it against God’s wrath and judgment (AP IV:82).

It's clear he hasn't studied the (W)ELS, LCMS essays on UOJ when he states, "Our seminary does not teach that a person can be eternally saved apart from faith in Christ, or that unbelievers are counted as righteous before God while they remain separated from Christ through unbelief."

But understanding the heresies in his fellowship is certainly secondary to his personal confession and what he teaches others. As long as he and the others running the blog maintain faithfulness to Scripture and subsequently the BOC they will come to the correct understanding by the grace of God.

Good stuff!

Brett Meyer said...

Correction: Rev. Paul Rydecki

LPC said...

Hi B.M.

Rev. Rydecki was one of those who follow this blog. He told me he often visits here. He wrote to my comment wall at Wittenberg and I was encouraged by his comments.

No, I do not think Pr. Paul is a UOJer. In fact his confession is wise and actually safe.

It is really perilous for UOJ fanatics to declare anyone righteous simply because the atonement has happened and by default.

It is more important what he confesses because he can use his confession as a yardstick to evaluate fellow WELsians. If he is clear as to what he stands for, that is the starting point.

As long as he and the others running the blog maintain faithfulness to Scripture and subsequently the BOC they will come to the correct understanding by the grace of God

I believe this will happen too. God spoke to Elija that he has his witnesses who have not bowed down to Baal.

There are people out there who do not buy UOJ, it just so happens there are not a lot of us (as in the case of Elijah's time). Some Synodical YES men want doctrine to be upheld by politics, fortunately it is the Word that determines doctrine and does not need a majority vote.

God bless,


Augustinian Successor said...

This Spencer chap has reverend father to his title. It's not confessional, it's not Lutheran. Fact is it's anti-confessional and anti-Lutheran. The title reverend father is reserved specifically only for bishops standing in apostolic succession. And in relation to so-called catholic Lutheran Brian P Westgate, the BCP 1549 is liturgical. It's nonsense to say that it's not liturgical simply because it does not conform to the Roman Canon. If he's consistent, not only is the BCP 1549 not liturgical so is the Roman Mass ever since the Reformation!

Augustinian Successor said...

Intrepid Lutherans have the right spirit. But it's people like Spencer with his title of reverend father which irks me no end. He'd do well to drop 'father.' It's neither catholic nor confessional.

LPC said...


I made a research on this 'father' business. Apparently there is a part of US history that this title was used in their clergy, even the Baptist and Methodist ministers at one point were called such.

I agree with you though. I will not use that as a title for myself if I was in ministry.

I would use Pastor as I think it is more Biblical.


Ichabod the Glory Has Departed said...

Pastor Spencer is the ONLY pastor I know who calls his church "Orthodox Lutheran." He does not hide the name Lutheran - not pretending to be generic Lutheran nor chameleon Protestant. I suggest starting with what a man believes, teaches, and confesses. My least favorite title combo is "Pastor Jim" or "Jim and Jovina, our co-pastors."

Augustinian Successor said...

Dear Kuya,

As it is, 'Pastor' is too 'humbling' a term for some people. Again, it really wearies saying this but father is not supposed to be used as a term of endearment but a designation, a formal title and always used in reference to the third person. Reverend Father in God, Archbishop Thomas Cranmer of Canterbury. Only bishops were given the title at the Reformation. The idea of Father as a term of endearment was, you point out, Kuya, a latter innovation.

Pastor is both a term of endearment and a title. Although contrary to Pastor Gregory, there's no fixed rule about how to use the appellation. There many pastors both in the US and UK who employ Pastor as a 'pre-fix'to their first name as a form of addressing the clergy.

Ichabod the Glory Has Departed said...

Everyone should attend one entertainment event (formerly known as Sunday worship) where the minister comes out in a Hawaiian shirt and says, "Hi. I'm Pastor Bob and we have an exciting service for you today. The Faith-Tones will be singing again. The liturgical dancers are here. And my co-pastor Rev. Alice has a powerful PowerPoint for y'all."

LPC said...

Pr. Greg,

You mean the guy who also happens to be a life coach and a CEO of a group called church?

I should tell you about a thing called pastoral dynasty found here. Oh I forgot, you got that in the dynasty of Oral Roberts and Kenneth Hagin.


Ichabod the Glory Has Departed said...

Pastoral dynasties are common in abusive sects. It is a bad sign to see a son following his father in the same institution. It has happened in mainline churches with bad results too. Church people have this odd idea that a son is de facto the same as his father. One of the worst apostates in Missouri was Fuerbringer (Fibby), whose father was an excellent leader, professor, pastor.

LPC said...

Pr Greg,

In the Pesktecostals here, it is worst, because the wife is by default co-pastor too.


Timid Lutherans said...

What is wrong with that?

LPC said...

With which one? With having the pastor's wife as co-pastor? Or passing the mantle to the pastor's son?